Skills for defence

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Skills for defence

Post  Mister Wolfe on Tue Feb 23, 2010 6:11 pm

Hi!

I was wondering, that i couldn't find skills like EM Shield / Armor Compensation in the character sheets of some high-skilled characters from other players.

Are these skills that useless?
I've bought the skill books, but i haven't skilled them yet, and now i am a bit confused what to do.

I hope it's the right place for my question Very Happy

Greetings, Mister Wolfe
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Re: Skills for defence

Post  Spartacus Maximus on Wed Feb 24, 2010 9:43 am

IMO shield comp skills are pretty useless unless you want to fly a completely passive drake or some such. For pvp, I'd reckon they are completely useless.
Armor comp skills however are quite nice to have.

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Re: Skills for defence

Post  Spartacus Maximus on Wed Feb 24, 2010 9:45 am

But here goes a little explanation on how it all works...

[Mechanic category]
EM Armor Compensation / Explosive Armor Compensation / Kinetic Armor Compensation / Thermic Armor Compensation
[Engineering category]
EM Shield Compensation / Explosive Shield Compensation / Kinetic Shield Compensation / Thermic Shield Compensation

Note: the skill "Shield Compensation" is not part of this group of skills; it affects shield boosters, as should be clear from it’s description.

Skill description:

Quote:To active armor hardeners: 3% bonus per skill level to Armor EM resistance when the modules are not active
To passive armor hardeners: 5% bonus per skill level to Armor EM resistance


All compensation skills work the same, only the resistance type varies per skill and whether it affects armor or shield resistances.


Explanation:

These skills affect two different types of modules, confusingly called ‘active hardeners’ and ‘passive hardeners’.
Usually when talking about resistance modules, all things referred to as ‘hardeners’ are active modules – meaning that these modules have to be activated ause capacitor to run. It are the modules in the categories Armor Hardeners and Shield Hardeners on the market (see how they are called ‘hardeners’ ingame too?).
‘Passive hardeners’ are resistance modules which do not use capacitor and do not have to be activated; they always have an effect when fitted, but their effect is smaller than the effect of hardeners. The passive modules are called Resistance Plating and Energized Plating for armor and Shield Resistance Amplifiers for shield.

Now that we’ve established which modules the skills have an effect on, let’s have a look at what effect they have exactly. Here the confusion only grows…

The “3% bonus per skill level” to hardeners only applies when the module is NOT active. It has no effect at all on the resistances when the module is actually doing what you’ve fitted it for – actively strengthening your resists; therefore this effect is generally regarded as pretty worthless except in cases where you’ve run out of capacitor or when you’re trying to use Invulnerability Fields as a (pretty weak) passive omni-tank.

So when your hardener is not active, you get a small increase (3% at level 1, 15% at level 5) in your resistances. The increase works the same as all increases to your resistances: it’s not simply added to your current resist but it’s subtracted from the unresisted part. A couple of examples will explain that further.

WRONG: 30% resist before, put module with 15% effect on, 45% resist after
RIGHT: 30% + ( 70% * 0.15) = 30% + 10.5% = 40.5%
Formula: resistance + ((100 – resistance) * resistance added) = new resistance

(Note there’s also a stacking penalty when you’re using the same module more than once, but it goes too far to explain that here.)

(continued below)
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Re: Skills for defence

Post  Spartacus Maximus on Wed Feb 24, 2010 9:49 am

(Armor/shield compensation continued)

You might think that you now know how the skill will work with passive modules too, unfortunately that’s not the case. The “5% bonus per skill level” for passive modules isn’t applied directly to the resistances, but to the effect of the modules! And again they’re not simply added, but they actually are percentage increase to the effect. So for example an explosion dampening amplifier ii which has a normal effect of 37.5% will have an effect of 37.5 * 1.25 = 46.88% if you have Explosive Shield Compensation at level 5. The 46.88% is then applied to the resistance as described above.

Some notes:


* These skills also affect modules which affect more than one resistance, such as invulnerability fields and energized adaptive nano membranes. Each skill will only affect the corresponding resistance effect of those modules.

* Tech 2 passive modules can get an effect which approaches the effect of hardeners, without using any capacitor.

* In my examples I have used level 5 of the skills to calculate new resists. It may or may not be worth to train these skills to level 5, depending on how much you rely on passive modules. Personally, I kept these skills at level 4 since I think I have more useful skills to train instead of taking these all the way up to 5.



Tactical Shield Manipulation

[Engineering category] Tactical Shield Manipulation

Skill description:

Quote:Skill at preventing damage from penetrating the shield, including the use of shield hardeners and other advanced shield modules. Reduces the chance of damage penetrating the shield when it falls below 25% by 5% per skill level, with 0% chance at level 5.



Explanation:

Whenever you get hit while your shields are below 25%, there is a chance your armour will take damage too.
What Tactical Shield Manipulation does is lowering the point where you can get damage bleeding through. At level 1 it’s at 20%, level 2 15%, level 3 10%, level 4 5%, and level 5 0% - meaning you’ll never get armour damage before your shields are completely down.


Some notes:


* No you will not be invulnerable if you train this skill to level 5 (as you now should understand).

* Generally this skill is considered pretty worthless since shield tankers usually keep their shields above 30% and armour tankers lose their shields very quickly and thus aren’t in the danger zone very long.

* A good reason to train this skill to level 4 is getting access to Tech 2 shield hardeners. The only reason to train this skill to level 5 is to be able train Capital Shield Operation.

* There's some debate as to what damage gets applied to your armour. Some people think the damage gets spread between your shields and armour, so if you take 100 damage you might get 50 damage to your shields and 50 to your armour. Others say this armour damage is extra damage – if you take 100 damage while your shields are low, you might take the full 100 damage to your shields and a 50 extra damage to your armour.
If the first case is true, training Tactical Shield Manipulation will make passive shield tanks slightly worse at low level of shield. I think that's a moot point though, since once your shields drop to the range where Tactical Shield Manipulation has effect your passive tank is well and truly broken and you should be warping out anyway.

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